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| Registered: October 30, 2011 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 1,870 |
| | Posted: | | | | I am seeing some inconsistances in the way things have been done. And I am wondering if I am just looking at old entries before a rules clarification.
I notice that some UPC's that have multiple cuts of a movie (extended, director, special edition, etc) and the cuts are on separate discs have what look like optional child profiles for the additional disc/cut.
And I am noticing some that do not.
Is the optional child profile for the same movie and different cut (when on a different disc) allowed. It seems to be, but I just wanted to clarify.
An example of one that does is UPC 883929007691 "The Excorcist: Director's Cut & Theatrical Version", it has a child profile for the theatrical cut and they are on two separate disc's.
That condition does not happen too often in Blu-ray since many that have multiple versions use a single disc with seamless branching.
I just wanted to double check. Because I do see some and it is allowed for 3d/BD/DVD combo's also....I hope I didn't open up a can o worms by mentoining 3D lol. But it seems to be allowed for moe than that. But sometmimes it is hard to track down rules that have been re-clarified since the rules have been last updated. | | | | Last edited: by Scooter1836 |
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| Registered: September 26, 2007 |  Posts: 488 |
| | Posted: | | | | From the rules:
"The term "Box Set" is used to define any release that includes more than one film. The main examples are:
Sets where each film is packaged individually, and held together in a package of some kind.
Sets where each film is on a separate disc, but not individually packaged. This includes gatefold Digipaks and 2-Disc sets in normal DVD cases.
Sets containing 2 films, one on each side of Dual-Sided DVD.
Create individual profiles for each movie in these Box Sets."
Seems pretty clear to me that child profiles are okay as long as the different versions are on separate discs or sides of a disc. |
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| Registered: October 30, 2011 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 1,870 |
| | Posted: | | | | That is what I thought, thanks |
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| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation:  | | Posts: 17,334 |
| | Posted: | | | | I normally see this one go back and forth on if the rules allows it or not. Because the rules say different films. And people can't seem to agree if a different cut = a different film. Some say yes... some say no. Me personally... I don't know what I think... but it is probably something Ken needs to clarify. | | | | Pete |
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| Registered: March 14, 2007 |  Posts: 2,337 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Addicted2DVD: Quote:
Because the rules say different films. Rules doesn't say that. |
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| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 17,334 |
| | Posted: | | | | it says more then one film... excuse me for not using the exact words in the rules. But the fact still remains that some people feel that different cuts of a film count as more then one film... and some people do not feel that different cuts count as more then one film.
As I said... I don't know which way I personally feel on this matter. just that there is not an agreement on this as far as I have seen from the other threads dealing with this. And that it may be something Invelos will have to clarify. | | | | Pete |
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| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | Kulju:
The rules do make reference to boxsets contain more than ONE film. Pete discussed this at some length and he does have background in this. I would not call multiple versions of the same film to be consistent with no set definitions. How many profiles of the same film do we need in the database for a minor variation, usually runtime. At the time the rules were developed it appeared that most films would be handled using DVD-18 technology and seamless branching or dual sided for ff and widescreen. I just don't think we need a gazillion profiles of the same thing to account for every variant. This was also why the rules stated to use the longest runtime, granted that refers to seamless branching, because that is where it was thought the industry was headed, but the concept is the same. | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
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| Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Posts: 2,337 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Winston Smith: Quote:
Kulju:
The rules do make reference to boxsets contain more than ONE film. If I would give you an envelope (boxset) containing two one dollar bills (films), would you say that I only gave you a dollar because the bills are the same? Quote:
How many profiles of the same film do we need in the database for a minor variation, usually runtime. And/or different Aspect ratio, subtitles, Audio Tracks, Features, etc. My point is that nowhere in the rules it said that the films must be different. It just say: more than one. | | | | Last edited: by Kulju |
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| Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Posts: 2,337 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Addicted2DVD: Quote:
it says more then one film... excuse me for not using the exact words in the rules Adding word different to the rule, which doesn't exist there, would change the rule completely. At the moment per rules we can contribute two exactly the same films as a boxset if we like. It doesn't even have to be a different cut. | | | | Last edited: by Kulju |
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| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 17,334 |
| | Posted: | | | | I understand what you are saying... what I am saying is that saying 2 films can, and has been read both ways... which is why I have no personal opinion on it... I am say that I can see both sides of it. Which is why I believe it is something that can get both yes and no votes if it is done. Which is why I said it is something that Ken may have to clarify. | | | | Pete |
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| Registered: May 20, 2007 | Reputation:  | | Posts: 2,934 |
| | Posted: | | | | I do not see what the problem is.
We already have a way to enter multiple versions of a film, and have been doing it already.
Think BD/DVD combos. They are listed in the Boxset section of the rules, but really are entered as a "Bonus Feature Film"
Profile the primary (marketed or version on disc 1 as listed on the cover), then each additional version enter as a child profile.
Charlie |
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| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting CharlieM: Quote:
Profile the primary (marketed or version on disc 1 as listed on the cover), then each additional version enter as a child profile. This is how I would do it as well. turning it into a Box Set doesn't make sense to me. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
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| Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Posts: 2,337 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
Quoting CharlieM:
Quote:
Profile the primary (marketed or version on disc 1 as listed on the cover), then each additional version enter as a child profile.
This is how I would do it as well. turning it into a Box Set doesn't make sense to me. I agree that this makes most sense and this is they way I would contribute, and have contributed them (I admit). The only problem is that this method is not supported by the rules. The other problem comes with the program feature terminology. If you add child profile to any other profile you must use a program feature called "Box set contents". At that moment by the rules it's not a Box Set, but by the program terminology it is. We definitely need a rule clarification/modification. Before that happens (if ever), the only way to do this kind of contribution by the book, is to follow contribution rules.  In the future, if these come in my way , I continue to contribute them by using the method described our Martian friend above. If I get no votes, I take 'em like a man  |
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| Registered: October 30, 2011 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 1,870 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
Quoting CharlieM:
Quote:
Profile the primary (marketed or version on disc 1 as listed on the cover), then each additional version enter as a child profile.
This is how I would do it as well. turning it into a Box Set doesn't make sense to me. I agree also and that is how that UPC is done and in fact how many of the 3D releases haev been done |
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| Registered: October 30, 2011 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 1,870 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Kulju: Quote:
Quoting TheMadMartian:
Quote:
Quoting CharlieM:
Quote:
Profile the primary (marketed or version on disc 1 as listed on the cover), then each additional version enter as a child profile.
This is how I would do it as well. turning it into a Box Set doesn't make sense to me.
I agree that this makes most sense and this is they way I would contribute, and have contributed them (I admit). The only problem is that this method is not supported by the rules.
The other problem comes with the program feature terminology. If you add child profile to any other profile you must use a program feature called "Box set contents". At that moment by the rules it's not a Box Set, but by the program terminology it is. We definitely need a rule clarification/modification. Before that happens (if ever), the only way to do this kind of contribution by the book, is to follow contribution rules.
In the future, if these come in my way , I continue to contribute them by using the method described our Martian friend above. If I get no votes, I take 'em like a man Well unfortunately the "Box Set Contents" has been has really been turned into "Child Profiles" or "Set Contents" long before this. Ever since they sarted allowing the DVD children in BD/DVD combo packs. |
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| Registered: May 20, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 2,934 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Scooter1836: Quote:
Quoting Kulju:
Quote:
Quoting TheMadMartian:
Quote:
Quoting CharlieM:
Quote:
Profile the primary (marketed or version on disc 1 as listed on the cover), then each additional version enter as a child profile.
This is how I would do it as well. turning it into a Box Set doesn't make sense to me.
I agree that this makes most sense and this is they way I would contribute, and have contributed them (I admit). The only problem is that this method is not supported by the rules.
The other problem comes with the program feature terminology. If you add child profile to any other profile you must use a program feature called "Box set contents". At that moment by the rules it's not a Box Set, but by the program terminology it is. We definitely need a rule clarification/modification. Before that happens (if ever), the only way to do this kind of contribution by the book, is to follow contribution rules.
In the future, if these come in my way , I continue to contribute them by using the method described our Martian friend above. If I get no votes, I take 'em like a man
Well unfortunately the "Box Set Contents" has been has really been turned into "Child Profiles" or "Set Contents" long before this. Ever since they sarted allowing the DVD children in BD/DVD combo packs. Actually "Box Set" (program wise) has been a misnomer, since the advent of "Bonus Feature Film". Think "Ben Hur", or "The DAy the Earth Stood Still", which included previous releases of the same title. It should be change to "Set Contents" within the program. Charlie |
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