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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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Couples/People Credited Together, The Poll |
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| Registered: April 3, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 1,998 |
| | Posted: | | | | There seems to be some difference of opinion on how credits like these should be handled      So am posting this to try and get a forum agreement on how they should be credited 1] Use the Credited As: Only if supported by CLT James Keach [James & Stacy Keach] Stacy Keach [James & Stacy Keach] 2] Use the Credited As: Even if not supported by CLT (Like honorifics) this would of coarse need a rule change James Keach [James & Stacy Keach] Stacy Keach [James & Stacy Keach] 3] Always Credit individually: Never use the Credited As James Keach Stacy Keach |
| | Registered: September 18, 2008 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 2,650 |
| | Posted: | | | | Common sense says 3. |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | But the credits, and I believe the rules, say 1.  | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 6,635 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
But the credits, and I believe the rules, say 1. So do you enter a producer credit followed by two names with both names as one? Entering two names into the name field is simply mindlessly following a Rule contrary to the usefulness of the data. But, be my guest. | | | | Hal |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 20,111 |
| | Posted: | | | | Common sense seems pretty obvious here. Option #3 | | | | Corey |
| | Registered: March 20, 2007 | Reputation:  | | Posts: 2,851 |
| | Posted: | | | | Option #3.
--------------- |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting hal9g: Quote:
Quoting TheMadMartian:
Quote:
But the credits, and I believe the rules, say 1.
So do you enter a producer credit followed by two names with both names as one? It depends on how they are credited. Produced by John Smith and Jane Smith, no. Produced by John and Jane Smith, yes. I mean, if they choose to be credited as a team, why in the world would I change it?  Quote:
Entering two names into the name field is simply mindlessly following a Rule contrary to the usefulness of the data. Funny how the tune changes when it is something you find useless. I am quite sure that, for some users, leaving out crew, that do the exact same job, simply because they don't match the crew chart exactly, is "simply mindlessly following a Rule contrary to the usefulness of the data" as well. Should the rules be dambed there as well? Quote:
But, be my guest. Thanks for your permission but, as it follows the rules, I didn't really need it. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar | | | | Last edited: by TheMadMartian |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 6,635 |
| | Posted: | | | | Well, it's nice to see that based on the poll, not many agree with you.
Some people understand that we actually want to be able to search for individual credits in DVDP, so we can see how many films an individual person was involved in.
Entering two people into a field designed for a single person is just plain stupid and I seriously doubt that Ken intended for the Rules to force us to do that.
Do I need to bother to cite the oh so many ways that we do NOT enter the cast and crew exactly as credited and in the same order?
It's no wonder this place has become a joke! | | | | Hal |
| | Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Reputation: |  Posts: 4,678 |
| | Posted: | | | | Seems like just in the "When is a name right" thread, some people want to document the documentation (i e credits) and some people want to document the actual roles and people.
I'm with Hal on this. I see no upside to knowing that they were credited together, as opposed to being able to see their individual credits. | | | My freeware tools for DVD Profiler users.
Gunnar |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting hal9g: Quote:
Well, it's nice to see that based on the poll, not many agree with you. As you are so fond of saying, polls are not rules and, as you have admitted, the rules do not cover option #3. Quote:
Some people understand that we actually want to be able to search for individual credits in DVDP, so we can see how many films an individual person was involved in.
Entering two people into a field designed for a single person is just plain stupid and I seriously doubt that Ken intended for the Rules to force us to do that. So when I see a credit of, Earth, Wind & Fire as Benefit Performers, I can enter... Maurice White as Benefit Performers Verdine White as Benefit Performers Philip Bailey as Benefit Performers Johnny Graham as Benefit Performers Larry Dunn as Benefit Performers Ralph Johnson as Benefit Performers Al McKay as Benefit Performers Andrew Woolfolk as Benefit Performers Fred White as Benefit Performers Roland Bautista as Benefit Performers Beloyd Taylor as Benefit Performers ...is that what I can do so that we can track the individual credits? Quote:
Do I need to bother to cite the oh so many ways that we do NOT enter the cast and crew exactly as credited and in the same order? Yes, please cite the oh so many ways that we do not enter the cast and crew, exactly as credited, which violate the rules. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar | | | | Last edited: by TheMadMartian |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting GSyren: Quote:
Seems like just in the "When is a name right" thread, some people want to document the documentation (i e credits) and some people want to document the actual roles and people.
I'm with Hal on this. I see no upside to knowing that they were credited together, as opposed to being able to see their individual credits. I never said that there was an upside, only that it is what the rules require and I don't think I have seen anybody claim otherwise. If everyone wants to go with what they believe is useful, then we should just go all in and adopt surfeur's method. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | Registered: March 29, 2007 | | Reputation: |  Posts: 4,479 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
If everyone wants to go with what they believe is useful, then we should just go all in and adopt surfeur's method.  Nice Wish for 2011 !!! | | | | Images from movies |
| | Registered: March 29, 2007 | Reputation:  | | Posts: 2,749 |
| | Posted: | | | | #2 for me because it shows the data as it was presented. | | | | Marty - Registered July 10, 2004, User since 2002. |
| | Registered: May 26, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 2,879 |
| | Posted: | | | | #3
Each of these people is credited individually. They're not credited as a group.
So when I see Gerry & Sylvia Anderson (just taking the first credit as example) I see Gerry Anderson and Sylvia Anderson. I don't see Gerry Anderson credited as Gerry & Sylvia Anderson. He's credited as Gerry Anderson and she's credited as Sylvia Anderson.
I see in the same vein as an invitation ... say I invite my cousins to a function. I send the invitation to Mr. & Mrs. Weisert. This does not mean they are invited only as a couple. If only one is able to attend, the invitation still stands.
As far as Martian's argument toward band credits, if a credit read the band's name, I would credit the band as a unit. So if the credit read "The Rolling Stones" I would type that. If the credit had "The Rolling Stones" as a header with Mick, Keith, Ron & Charlie's names below, I would enter it that way. If the credits were simply Mick, Keith, Ron & Charlie's names, I would not enter them as "The Rolling Stones." Band credits do not apply in this case, since the individual names are listed.
The only issue I have that involves band names that is like this, is when the credit reads something like "Benny Goodman and His Orchestra." I am uncertain how to handle these sorts of credits, which we really only see in older films and are virtually identical to this problem, but locally have been using "Benny Goodman" and "Benny Goodman's Orchestra." | | | If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world.
-- Thorin Oakenshield |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 6,635 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
So when I see a credit of, Earth, Wind & Fire as Benefit Performers, I can enter...
Maurice White as Benefit Performers
Verdine White as Benefit Performers
Philip Bailey as Benefit Performers
Johnny Graham as Benefit Performers
Larry Dunn as Benefit Performers
Ralph Johnson as Benefit Performers
Al McKay as Benefit Performers
Andrew Woolfolk as Benefit Performers
Fred White as Benefit Performers
Roland Bautista as Benefit Performers
Beloyd Taylor as Benefit Performers
...is that what I can do so that we can track the individual credits? Those names do not appear anywhere in the credits, so obviously, no! "Earth, Wind and Fire" is clearly the name of a group. "James & Stacey Keach" is clearly shorthand for crediting two individual people. If you don't see the difference, then it is pointless to discuss this further. Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
Quoting hal9g:
Quote:
Do I need to bother to cite the oh so many ways that we do NOT enter the cast and crew exactly as credited and in the same order?
Yes, please cite the oh so many ways that we do not enter the cast and crew, exactly as credited, which violate the rules. I never said anything about them violating the Rules, I said we enter credits all the time that do not match the film credits. One of your favorites, you cited yourself. Crew credits are constantly entered which do not appear in the crew table, as the Rules specifically require. Group dividers are constantly used when people appear individually in the credits with the same role. That's not the way they appear in the credits. Two columns of film credits are entered as one column, sometimes going left to right and then down, sometimes going top to bottom then to the right. Accents are dropped, both because people do not know the proper way to convert all caps, and because of a stupid rule and because some are not reproducible in the program. Credits from the beginning of the movie are dropped in favor of closing credits; they don't match the film exactly and in the same order. Credits are dropped because they don't fall within "the standard credits". Stunt people are dropped depending on where they appear in the credits. I could go on, but I think I've made the point. | | | | Hal | | | | Last edited: by hal9g |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 3,197 |
| | Posted: | | | | I don't know if this is still practiced but I used to see names like The Coen Brothers split into their individual names even if they are not individually credited. That is creating something that doesn't exist. This is a bit different though since they way I look at them, I see two individual credits and not a group. But I have no absolute answer, maybe there isn't one. | | | | First registered: February 15, 2002 |
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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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