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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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Combine ALL AGES-Rating with AGE 6 AND ABOVE rating details? |
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| Author |
Message |
| Registered: December 13, 2008 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 334 |
| | Posted: | | | | I’d like some opinions on the following:
If the DVD cover has an “ALL AGES” rating with no further rating details, but the the equivalent region-specific ratings information website (in this case kijkwijzer.nl) has an “AGE 6” rating WITH rating details (VIOLENCE) do we then combine the DVD cover’s ALL AGES rating with the AGE 6 rating details from the website?
BTW: The DVD itself and the screen also show no rating details.
My own take on the matter is that you can’t see the rating details seperately from the rating they accompany, so in my view the above scenario would lead to the profile having Certificate : ALL AGES, Rating Details: empty.
If you CAN separate them the profile would have “Rated ALL AGES for Violence” which doesn’t seem right.
Any opinions would be appreciated.
Specifics: Profile: 8-715664-018101 ; Rating details: http://www.kijkwijzer.nl/classificaties2.php?id=13083 |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | The rules tell us to use the rating shown on the DVD cover. I can't see how there is any other choice but to use 'All Ages'. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | Registered: December 13, 2008 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 334 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
The rules tell us to use the rating shown on the DVD cover. I can't see how there is any other choice but to use 'All Ages'. With no rating details, you mean? |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Mallrat: Quote:
Quoting TheMadMartian:
Quote:
The rules tell us to use the rating shown on the DVD cover. I can't see how there is any other choice but to use 'All Ages'.
With no rating details, you mean? Yes. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
|   | T!M | | Profiling since Dec. 2000 |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 8,736 |
| | Posted: | | | | The rating, obviously, is "AL", since that is what shown on the cover - no question about that. Now onto the rating details - let's have a look at the contribution rules on rating details: Quote:
Obtain the rating details in order of preference from:
• DVD case, usually on the bottom rear
• Rating page displayed on-screen
• Filmratings.com, or the equivalent region-specific ratings information website If option #1 and option #2 don't yield any results, then we go to option #3 - the "region-specific ratings information website". For this particular locality, that's www.kijkwijzer.nl. That indeed provides us the rating details for this particular film, so that's what should be entered per the rules. | | | | Last edited: by T!M |
| | Corne | | Registered: Nov. 1, 2000 |
| Registered: April 5, 2007 | | Posts: 1,059 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting T!M: Quote:
The rating, obviously, is "AL", since that is what shown on the cover - no question about that. Now onto the rating details - let's have a look at the contribution rules on rating details:
Quote:
Obtain the rating details in order of preference from:
• DVD case, usually on the bottom rear
• Rating page displayed on-screen
• Filmratings.com, or the equivalent region-specific ratings information website
If option #1 and option #2 don't yield any results, then we go to option #3 - the "region-specific ratings information website". For this particular locality, that's www.kijkwijzer.nl. That indeed provides us the rating details for this particular film, so that's what should be entered per the rules. That rating detail is linked to another Rating. It would be just absurd linking the details from another rating (Age 6) to this rating (AL). Moreover, the Age 6 rating and its corresponding rating details on that website isn't for this DVD, but for the airing of this film on television in 2003 (Canal+): Quote:
Organisatie: Canal+ In 2003 Canal+ was a pay TV channel (later rebranded into Film1). The DVD has been released one year later (2004) by Dutch Filmworks and has been re-rated. Why this isn't on the rating-website beats me, but you can't make up rating details for another rating. So I agree with The Martian and Mallrat. | | | | Cor | | | | Last edited: by Corne |
| | T!M | | Profiling since Dec. 2000 |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 8,736 |
| | Posted: | | | | I understand those concerns, but you're making a distinction that the rules simply do not make. The rules do not offer any if's or but's. Instead, they simply tell us where to get the rating details from, period. Quoting Corne: Quote:
Why this isn't on the rating-website beats me That's simply how the Dutch ratings website works - they don't list multiple ratings for the same film, but just list the accurate one. Which is exactly why your line of reasoning doesn't work, and why the rules can't make any exceptions like that. |
| | Corne | | Registered: Nov. 1, 2000 |
| Registered: April 5, 2007 | | Posts: 1,059 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting T!M: Quote:
I understand those concerns, but you're making a distinction that the rules simply do not make. The rules do not offer any if's or but's. Instead, they simply tell us where to get the rating details from, period.
Quoting Corne:
Quote:
Why this isn't on the rating-website beats me
That's simply how the Dutch ratings website works - they don't list multiple ratings for the same film, but just list the accurate one. Which is exactly why your line of reasoning doesn't work, and why the rules can't make any exceptions like that. The DVD is rated AL, period. It's on the back cover and the Dutch film rating website doesn't give any information about the rating of this DVD. Only about the airing of the film on television. We don't even know whether the version of the film on television is the same as the version of the film on DVD. Needless to say that I still agree with The Martian and Mallrat. | | | | Cor | | | | Last edited: by Corne |
| | T!M | | Profiling since Dec. 2000 |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 8,736 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Corne: Quote:
The DVD is rated AL, period. Not that it matters, but actually it's not. Instead, the distributor incorrectly slapped an "AL" logo on the cover, but it's wrong - as happens so often with stuff you see on the back cover (running times, audio tracks, subtitles, features, aspect ratios - you name it). But as I just said: that doesn't matter - I agree that per the rules, the rating is to be taken from the cover, wrong as it may be. No problem there. The rules on rating details, however, are different. The rest of your argument is perfectly nice, but again: you're making a distinction that the rules simply do not make. That's all. You want to enter what you feel is the right thing to do, which is perfectly understandable - it's just at odds with the rules. | | | | Last edited: by T!M |
| | Corne | | Registered: Nov. 1, 2000 |
| Registered: April 5, 2007 | | Posts: 1,059 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting T!M: Quote:
Quoting Corne:
Quote:
The DVD is rated AL, period.
Not that it matters, but actually it's not. Instead, the distributor incorrectly slapped an "AL" logo on the cover, but it's wrong - as happens so often with stuff you see on the back cover (running times, audio tracks, subtitles, features, aspect ratio's, you name it). As I said: that really doesn't matter - I agree that per the rules, the rating is to be taken from the cover, wrong as it may be. No problem there. The rules on rating details, however, are different.
The rest of your argument is perfectly nice, but again: you're making a distinction that the rules simply do not make. That's all. You want to enter what you feel is the right thing to do, which is perfectly understandable - it's just at odds with the rules. It's not against the rules. If a film is released in theaters Rated R with some rating details and later released on DVD as PG-13, would you then enter the rating details of the R-Rating from Filmratings.com? | | | | Cor | | | | Last edited: by Corne |
| | T!M | | Profiling since Dec. 2000 |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 8,736 |
| | Posted: | | | | As you well know, the American ratings board (and it's website) works entirely different than the Dutch one. The situation that occurs here - and quite frequently, too - simply doesn't happen in R1. The situation you're describing is entirely different - those are different cuts of the movie, with different ratings. These are not. | | | | Last edited: by T!M |
| | Corne | | Registered: Nov. 1, 2000 |
| Registered: April 5, 2007 | | Posts: 1,059 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting T!M: Quote:
As you well know, the American ratings board (and it's website) works entirely different than the Dutch one. The situation that occurs here - and quite frequently, too - simply doesn't happen in R1. The situation you're describing is entirely different - those are different cuts of the movie, with different ratings. These are not. How come that you are so sure that the airing of this film on television isn't a different cut? At least it has a different Rating than the DVD release. And you're telling me that you would do it differently for a R1 release. In other words interpreting the rules for a R1 release differently? The rules are written for the listing of DVD/Blu-Ray/HD DVD releases, not for listing theatrical releases, airings on television or digital copies. Quoting T!M: Quote:
Instead, the distributor incorrectly slapped an "AL" logo on the cover, but it's wrong - as happens so often with stuff you see on the back cover (running times, audio tracks, subtitles, features, aspect ratios - you name it). It isn't a misprint/incorrect on the cover because on disc and on screen it's also without rating details. The rating website doesn't support your claim because they don't even list the rating of the DVD release. | | | | Cor | | | | Last edited: by Corne |
| | T!M | | Profiling since Dec. 2000 |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 8,736 |
| | Posted: | | | | I've heard it all before, Corne... I'm not going to be sucked into this back and forth any further - we've had this debate many times before, and nothing's changed. I reiterate: you're making a distinction that the rules simply do not make. That, to me, is all there is to it. |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | Corne is absolutely correct. To enter ratings detalis, for a rating other that what is entered into the profile, simply makes no sense. If a disc is rated NR or Unrated, we don't add the details for the theatrical or TV showing, we leave it blank. This should be no different. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 17,334 |
| | Posted: | | | | I have to agree with Corne and the Martian on this one. | | | | Pete |
| | Registered: December 13, 2008 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 334 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Addicted2DVD: Quote:
I have to agree with Corne and the Martian on this one. "Mallrat, Corne and the Martian" you mean, surely?  Thank you all for your input.  |
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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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