Quoting T!M:

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For those that want to rely on a single mixed case/full case credit to "seal the deal", I'd like to repeat my earlier question: since when does that matter? Says who? It certainly doesn't matter to Invelos, since in the Elaine Corral Kendall example I quoted earlier, we even had a hyphenated Elaine Corral-Kendall credit, and Invelos still ruled that we parse it as E/C/K. How is this any different?

Different example: Philip Baker Hall. There again, we had an on-screen credit (see below, from 'In Good Company') that caused some to feel his last name was "Baker Hall", not "Hall". Still, we didn't go that way (thread), and we stuck with P/B/H. Again: how is this any different?



Look, I'd be happy to go with Ellen//Albertini Dow, but then I'd want to go back and use Philip//Baker Hall and Elaine//Corral Kendall as well: the arguments to do so are certainly exactly the same. But again: in the case of Elaine Corral Kendall Invelos explicitly ruled against that, and I just don't see how this is any different.

Tim in my estimation that particular credit supports a double barreled name. But OTOH let's get down to brass tacks. Agaian what difference dioes it make. Let us sppose that we have that particular credit style, plus one that supposts Baker/Hall, plus a Baker-Hall credit in another film.  Do we not have a tool called the CLT designed, supposedly, to be able to link differing credits for the same person. Let's say that the MOST COMMONLY credits name was Baker/Hall, then you simply follow the system. No need to fuss and moan over how do I do this name or that name anymore EVER. Just use the system and the tools that we have. Simple.

Quoting hal9g:

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Quoting Addicted2DVD:

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And wouldn't even argue about that if the surname field defaults on last word and is local only.

I could support that, even though it would mean having to "fix" a lot of surnames locally.

Hal:

I have to ask about this. Why would it require surname fixes locally, what relevance does the surname or parsing actually have to THIS program. Are you wanting to know if you are related to Mr. Baker-Hall, not the function of this program. What difference to you or anyone else within the confines of this program does whether parsing is correct or not actually provide... anything?

Quoting Winston Smith:

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Quoting hal9g:

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Quoting hal9g:

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Quoting Winston Smith:

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And BTW the meager documentation provided by Hal, sorry Hal, proves nothing beyond the last name she was born with. It does not support his references to Albertini Dow. Further she is an American actress so unlike some countries there is no Rule or even law that dictates preseuptiously how a woman MUST parse her last name. That is her choice, and I see no documentation that supports a double barrelled last name, it is a possibility but it is NOT a GIVEN.

"the meager documentation" was not provided by me, but it is more evidence than exists to show that it should be parsed E/A/D, therefore, as I said, I would parse it E//A D.

The reference shows her name as Ellen ALBERTINI DOW, clearly indicating that 'ALBERTINI DOW' is her surname.  It then goes on to refer to her as 'ALBERTINI DOW', further indicating that this is her surname.

Where is the documentation supporting that her surname is 'DOW'?

Lacking any, I  agree with Surfeur that is is an easy decision.

There is NO DOC to support that claim. Simply the misguided assumption of a single user applying HIS own standards

The documentation provided is from Wikipedia.  You may argue as to the accuracy of their data, but please don't pretend that Surfeur made this up on his own!

Show me ANY documentation that it should be parsed E/A/D, and we can begin a conversation; but not until.

Quoting Winston Smith:

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We have the tool deigned to deal with multiple credits by the same person...use it.

Yeah, a tool that is a complete joke!  Get real!

Quoting hal9g:

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Quoting Winston Smith:

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We have the tool deigned to deal with multiple credits by the same person...use it.

Yeah, a tool that is a complete joke!  Get real!

That's not an answer. I am on the record regarding the CLT and what I think of it and th whole premise of a priority name being selected based upon user data input. But that doesn't change the fact that it COULD function very well IF users would simply follow the data and stop worrying about this, that or something else. But the CLT is not the way I would have implemented the system

Quoting Winston Smith:

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Quoting hal9g:

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Quoting Winston Smith:

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We have the tool deigned to deal with multiple credits by the same person...use it.

Yeah, a tool that is a complete joke!  Get real!

That's not an answer. I am on the record regarding the CLT and what I think of it and th whole premise of a priority name being selected based upon user data input. But that doesn't change the fact that it COULD function very well IF users would simply follow the data and stop worrying about this, that or something else. But the CLT is not the way I would have implemented the system

I  refuse to recognize or use a tool that flatly does not work.  Constantly beating your head against a wall to try to get a totally flawed system to work is insane, IMHO.  Expecting people to know that someone has been credited differently in another film than what they see in the film credits they're looking at is simply nuts!

Quoting xradman:

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In this press clipping from her official website, her name is listed as Ellen Albertini-Dow.

Seals it for me!

Quoting Winston Smith:

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Just use the system and the tools that we have. Simple.

I do. Haven't I explained this? I "use the system and the tools that we have", and I get no-votes. I get no-votes both ways, whether I use E/A/D or E//A D. No-votes in both cases, that's my only problem here. Simple, indeed. Me telling those voters to "use the system and the tools that we have" isn't going to make those votes disappear, is it?

For the record, I'll state my personal preference again. My personal preference would be to put anything that isn't a first or a given name into the last name field. Unfortunately, that's not common practice around here, and the only guidance from Invelos on the matter is a ruling on how to parse Elaine Corral Kendall (E/C/K, despite a confirmed hyphenated credit). That ruling, as far as I can tell, applies here as well. If anything, we had a more substantial reason to go with E//C K there, in the form of an actual hyphenated credit in the database. Still, even with that, Invelos ruled E/C/K. Apparently, per Invelos, we need more than an actual hyphenated credit. And I certainly don't see anything like that.

Again, I'd be happy to go with Ellen//Albertini Dow, but then I'd want to go back and use Philip//Baker Hall and Elaine//Corral Kendall as well: the arguments to do so are certainly exactly the same. But again: in the case of Elaine Corral Kendall Invelos explicitly ruled against that. That ruling tells me something about this case - which is pretty much exactly the same - as well.

I'm not looking for the "whim of the day" here, and this is not about my personal preference (on the contrary!). This thread doesn't ask what you'd LIKE to do, but what we should do for contribution purposes. And for contribution purposes, we've got an Invelos ruling on E/C/K to consider, and so when the circumstances are the same - and here they are - then, for contribution purposes, I make the same call, whether I like it or not.