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  Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion Page: 1 2 3 4 5 ...8  Previous   Next
Child profile for each side of a double sided disc? (Locked)
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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorWinston Smith
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Registered: March 13, 2007
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I don't want to argue. I want you to recognize and address the points I make. If you can't or won't then your argument or simply saying you are wrong, my friend, simply doesn't hold any water.

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Billy Video
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorTheMadMartian
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Quoting Woola:
Quote:
I don't want to argue. I want you to recognize and address the points I make. If you can't or won't then your argument or simply saying you are wrong, my friend, simply doesn't hold any water.

Skip

The problem with this stance is that you are not giving what you are asking for.  Yes, TV sets have their own set of rules, but those rules tell us to create the child profiles inline with the standard rules.  The standard rules tell us to create a profile for each side of a multi-feature, multi-sided disc.

Rather than address that point in the rules, you simply say I am wrong.  I am sorry, but your arguement against creating a profile for each side isn't rule based, it is personal preference based. 
No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorWinston Smith
Don't be discommodious
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Thank you, Martian. Now I have something upon which to cogitate.

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Billy Video
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorAce_of_Sevens
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Quoting TheMadMartian:
Quote:
Rather than address that point in the rules, you simply say I am wrong.  I am sorry, but your arguement against creating a profile for each side isn't rule based, it is personal preference based. 

Yes, don't impose your personal preferences on the public DB. The rules do seem to say we should enter both sides. Even if it weren't ambiguous, this just makes more sense. They definitely don't come down strongly on one disc=one profile.
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorWinston Smith
Don't be discommodious
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BTw Martian, II definitely take exception to both you and Ace referring personal preference. The same could be said of your comments, Okay. You have posted an valid argument, the additional editorial comment was both unnecessary and insulting AAND weakens your argument.

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Billy Video
 Last edited: by Winston Smith
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorcvermeylen
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The rules say Disc-Level profiles can be used. It doesn't specifically state to create profiles per disc-side. And to my knowledge, this wasn't allowed for movies.

The Hammer Horror Series: The Franchise Collection (025192833328) is a boxset with 2 dual-sided discs.
Each disc-side contains 2 movies. There are only 2 childprofiles. Movie credits are separated using dividers.
Disc-ID's are added for both front and back-side.

I think the example I gave here is correct per the rules, and this is the way to handle TV series also.
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Chris
 Last edited: by cvermeylen
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar Contributorhal9g
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Quoting cvermeylen:
Quote:
The rules say Disc-Level profiles can be used. It doesn't specifically state to create profiles per disc-side. And to my knowledge, this wasn't allowed for movies.

The Hammer Horror Series: The Franchise Collection (025192833328) is a boxset with 2 dual-sided discs.
Each disc-side contains 2 movies. There are only 2 childprofiles. Movie credits are separated using dividers.
Disc-ID's are added for both front and back-side.

I think the example I gave here is correct per the rules, and this is the way to handle TV series also.


No actually, it is not correct per the Rules.  There should be four child profiles, each containing data on two films using dividers.
Hal
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorWinston Smith
Don't be discommodious
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While I completely understand , The Martians logic, I have come to the conclusion that he is operatting from his personal preference., with no firm basis in the Rules. I have already totally explained the entire issue. And were I working from my own personal preference I would handle movies as cver described  to consistently NOT create non-existent discs.  There is a reason for handling movies in that fashion as I have outlined, those reasons do NOT apply to Television., so my answer not only stands it is the correct answer per the RULES.

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Billy Video
DVD Profiler Unlimited Registrantgardibolt
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The TV rules are a little vague on this point frankly.  They have a space for Disc ID and they then say to profile the discs.  They don't specifically address the double-sided disc one way or another.  But they do say:

Quote:
Create each of these individual profiles in line with the standard Contribution Rules with one exception - Cover Images.


That is, except for cover images, the individual profiles are to be in line with standard Contribution Rules. 

Quote:
Add disc information for each disc using a DVD-ROM drive. Use the default descriptions wherever possible; do not change "Main Feature" to the film’s title. Use one description per disc. If a disc is double-sided, there is only one description for that disc.

Do not enter each side as a separate disc.


I can see the appeal of using the Box Set rules by analogy:

The term "Box Set" is used to define any release that includes more than one film. The main examples are:

Quote:
Sets where each film is packaged individually, and held together in a package of some kind.
Sets where each film is on a separate disc, but not individually packaged. This includes gatefold Digipaks and 2-Disc sets in normal DVD cases.
Sets containing 2 films, one on each side of Dual-Sided DVD.
Create individual profiles for each movie in these Box Sets. Use individual UPCs if they are available or use Disc ID (read on a DVD-ROM) if not.


Unfortunately, the only time that the TV rules say to use the Box Set rules is:

Quote:
Note: In rare cases where multiple Complete TV Series are packaged together, the Box-set rules can be applied, treating each series like a single film - applying the above rules for it’s individual profile.


That is, Ken seems to think that a complete series/season is to be treated like a single film.  So I reluctantly am shifting my position to a single child profile for each side of the double-sided disc.  The rules are ambiguous but read together they seem to point much more strongly in favor of one rather than two (even though my *personal preference*    would be two).
"This movie has warped my fragile little mind."
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorTheMadMartian
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Quoting hal9g:
Quote:
Quoting cvermeylen:
Quote:
The rules say Disc-Level profiles can be used. It doesn't specifically state to create profiles per disc-side. And to my knowledge, this wasn't allowed for movies.

The Hammer Horror Series: The Franchise Collection (025192833328) is a boxset with 2 dual-sided discs.
Each disc-side contains 2 movies. There are only 2 childprofiles. Movie credits are separated using dividers.
Disc-ID's are added for both front and back-side.

I think the example I gave here is correct per the rules, and this is the way to handle TV series also.


No actually, it is not correct per the Rules.  There should be four child profiles, each containing data on two films using dividers.

This is correct.  Not only is it allowed, it is required by the rules.
No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorWinston Smith
Don't be discommodious
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But the verbiage in the boxset Rules is also clear to me, as I have exoplained. The unfortunate practice of parsing each word as opposed to viewing the WHOLE, is the ONLY manner in which the Martian's theory stands up. When viewed as a whole it simply doesn't hold water. I notice in this instance theiir is also a tendency to pase words and ignore the grammar and it's significance, and I have discussed this as well

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Billy Video
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorTheMadMartian
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Quoting gardibolt:
Quote:
The TV rules are a little vague on this point frankly.  They have a space for Disc ID and they then say to profile the discs.  They don't specifically address the double-sided disc one way or another.  But they do say:

Quote:
Create each of these individual profiles in line with the standard Contribution Rules with one exception - Cover Images.


That is, except for cover images, the individual profiles are to be in line with standard Contribution Rules. 

Quote:
Add disc information for each disc using a DVD-ROM drive. Use the default descriptions wherever possible; do not change "Main Feature" to the film’s title. Use one description per disc. If a disc is double-sided, there is only one description for that disc.

Do not enter each side as a separate disc.

I had to address this point as it deals with a single feature disc that is, either, a flipper...one movie spread over two sides...or a dual sided disc with Widescreen on one side and Fullscreen on the other.  It does not apply to multi-feature, multi-sided discs.  Those are dealt with in the Box Set rules
No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorTheMadMartian
Alien with an attitude
Registered: March 13, 2007
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Quoting Woola:
Quote:
But the verbiage in the boxset Rules is also clear to me, as I have exoplained. The unfortunate practice of parsing each word as opposed to viewing the WHOLE, is the ONLY manner in which the Martian's theory stands up. When viewed as a whole it simply doesn't hold water. I notice in this instance theiir is also a tendency to pase words and ignore the grammar and it's significance, and I have discussed this as well

Skip

That's the great thing about opinions isn't it?  From my point of view, your's doesn't hold water either.  Btw, I never ignore grammar.  As a parser, I can't.  It is quite unfortunate, however, that the rule writers, in quite a few cases, did. 
No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorscotthm
Registered: March 20, 2007
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Quoting Woola:
Quote:
And were I working from my own personal preference I would handle movies as cver described  to consistently NOT create non-existent discs.

I don't consider the creation of a "non-existent" disc (i.e. the flip side of a disc) as a profile to be any more problematic than the creation of a profile from a box with a UPC code on it but that has all it's discs in child profiles.  I'm not sure I have a clear grasp of the rules on this issue, but from a purely philosophical perspective I'd rather have a profile consist of the B side of a DVD, which actually has a movie or television episode on it, than an empty box with a UPC but all discs in different profiles.  IOW, I'm more interested in the content than the packaging.

---------------
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorWinston Smith
Don't be discommodious
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Quoting TheMadMartian:
Quote:
Quoting Woola:
Quote:
But the verbiage in the boxset Rules is also clear to me, as I have exoplained. The unfortunate practice of parsing each word as opposed to viewing the WHOLE, is the ONLY manner in which the Martian's theory stands up. When viewed as a whole it simply doesn't hold water. I notice in this instance theiir is also a tendency to pase words and ignore the grammar and it's significance, and I have discussed this as well

Skip

That's the great thing about opinions isn't it?  From my point of view, your's doesn't hold water either.  Btw, I never ignore grammar.  As a parser, I can't.  It is quite unfortunate, however, that the rule writers, in quite a few cases, did. 


Very true, Martian. ERxcept you did not present yourself as voicing YOUR opinion or anyone else's. I supplied a very detailed and point by point argument and while your response was the best I have seen, it still did not address what I had said. But your accusation that I was dealing with my personal preference, while not similarly portraying your opinion as your personal preference, completely destroyed any argument you had. My argument is based in a detailed and fact-based argument, go back and re-read them and then address them.

Allow me to add at this juncture that I presented an argument without attack or insult directed at ANYONE. The same cannot be said to be true of others however.

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Billy Video
 Last edited: by Winston Smith
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorWinston Smith
Don't be discommodious
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Also, Martian, like uit or not. Lacking a comment from Jen, I'll fall to my interpretation BEFORE yours or anyone else's. You just don't have the background knowledge or the two years tthat was spent in designing the system.

So, from my point of view my opinion trumps all, except for Ken. The only other person who has the ability is Dan W, since we worked on it together. If and when he chooses to weigh in, great. I say that only because myopinion, without Ken's is the closest there is to the Rules intention far closer than yours or anyone else's save for DanW.

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Billy Video
 Last edited: by Winston Smith
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