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    Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion Page: 1 2  Previous   Next
Use of dividers when no roles, or dividers, are present in the credits.
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DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorTheMadMartian
Alien with an attitude
Registered: March 13, 2007
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Quoting VirusPil:
Quote:
I would allow both.

If we can invent roles, why not also dividers. (Of course mentioned in the contribution notes)

Because one is specifically allowed in the rules, the other is not.
No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorVirusPil
uncredited
Registered: January 1, 2009
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Quoting TheMadMartian:
Quote:
Quoting VirusPil:
Quote:
I would allow both.

If we can invent roles, why not also dividers. (Of course mentioned in the contribution notes)

Because one is specifically allowed in the rules, the other is not.


Of course correct, but it is also not explicit forbidden.

So I thought you asked for the opinion.
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorT!M
Profiling since Dec. 2000
Registered: March 13, 2007
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Quoting VirusPil:
Quote:
Of course correct, but it is also not explicit forbidden.

This is turning out to become a recurring problem around here... That really shouldn't be thought of as a valid line of reasoning. Basic example: the rules don't explicitly forbid contributing the cover scans upside-down. Does that mean we should do that? I hope you understand the problem. If "it's not explicitly forbidden" is a valid excuse, then we can mess up pretty much each and every field beyond belief...
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorVirusPil
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Registered: January 1, 2009
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Quoting T!M:
Quote:
Quoting VirusPil:
Quote:
Of course correct, but it is also not explicit forbidden.

This is turning out to become a recurring problem around here... That really shouldn't be thought of as a valid line of reasoning. Basic example: the rules don't explicitly forbid contributing the cover scans upside-down. Does that mean we should do that? I hope you understand the problem. If "it's not explicitly forbidden" is a valid excuse, then we can mess up pretty much each and every field beyond belief...


Just to stay on your example: I couln't find anywhere a part of the rules which state in which direction cover images should be contributed, which leaves us the freedom to contribute such covers like the book of eli how it can be read.

Do we really need all worded in rules?  (I don't hope so)
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantJ68
Registered: September 11, 2010
Posts: 42
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Quoting T!M:
Quote:
Basic example: the rules don't explicitly forbid contributing the cover scans upside-down. Does that mean we should do that?


Hi T!M,
I hope you are well.  A recent example saw a front cover being used as a back cover! (The Stormriders Trilogy).

Speaking as a newcomer here, it does appear that there is a very simplistic approach to Rules.  The Rules can be broken into 2 distinct groups: those that say "you can" and those that say "you can't." There doesn't appear to be any attempt to reconcile these 2 positions and extrapolate a reasonable position when cracks appear.

For example, disallowing the creation of Dividers because the Rules specfically allow for it within Roles is unsophisticated; it merely relies on utilising the 2 categories of rules as stated above.  However, all it means is that when the Rules for Dividers were developed, they hadn't considered "what if" there's a group of actors in a non-standard Role.  So, a debate on the pro's and con's of utilising Dividers should be based on the merits of actually using the Dividers rather than merely stating the Rules say it's allowed for Roles and but don't say its allowed for Dividers...

What do you think?
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorAddicted2DVD
Registered: March 13, 2007
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the covers for "The Stormriders Trilogy" probably just never been updated. Using front cover for front and back is exactly per rules for pre-releases.

Rules Quote:
Quote:
Do not contribute generic "Coming Soon" images. If the back image is not yet available (as in a pre-release), use the front images in both places.


So as I said it probably was just never updated after the release.
Pete
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantJ68
Registered: September 11, 2010
Posts: 42
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Quoting Addicted2DVD:
Quote:
Rules Quote:
Quote:
Do not contribute generic "Coming Soon" images. If the back image is not yet available (as in a pre-release), use the front images in both places.


So as I said it probably was just never updated after the release.

Thanks Addicted2DVD, you help my point.  The above situation was considered and a Ruling was given.
 Last edited: by J68
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorTheMadMartian
Alien with an attitude
Registered: March 13, 2007
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Quoting VirusPil:
Quote:
Of course correct, but it is also not explicit forbidden.

So I thought you asked for the opinion.

This poll is about what we can do, not what we should do.  I don't think the rules say we can, but I wanted to see what other people thought.
No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorAddicted2DVD
Registered: March 13, 2007
Reputation: Highest Rating
United States Posts: 17,334
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Quoting J68:
Quote:
Quoting Addicted2DVD:
Quote:
Rules Quote:
Quote:
Do not contribute generic "Coming Soon" images. If the back image is not yet available (as in a pre-release), use the front images in both places.


So as I said it probably was just never updated after the release.

Thanks Addicted2DVD, you help my point.  The above situation was considered and a Ruling was given.



Yeah... it was considered... worked out and presented to the owners for them to say either yes or no.

Since making these boards the owners gave us a specific forum to attempt to do this HERE. Such discussions really shouldn't take place in the contribution forum which is meant to discuss how to contribute to the rules as they are now.
Pete
 Last edited: by Addicted2DVD
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributormdnitoil
Registered: March 14, 2007
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Well, as long as we're throwing opinions out there, I'll add mine.  Personally, I voted against the made up dividers.  For me it's pretty simple as I have very little use for group dividers at all.  I fully recognize that my opinion is in the minority, but I still look at this program as a database.  I have a field for the actor's name, I have a field for the role.  Stick in the actor's name and stick in the role.  Life couldn't be simpler.  On very rare occasions, credits come up such as The Tavern, so and so played the Bartender, so and so played the Innkeeper, etc.  In these extremely rare cases, group dividers add the addtional context that was missing in the straight actor/role approach.  That is about the only use I have for group dividers.  Any other use is, in my opinion, simply a misguided attempt to recreate moving images into a text screen.  It also, in my opinion, corrupts my data.  Now I'm stuck with actor/no role.  Pretty darn useless as I'm perfectly aware that the actor had a role and it's easily identified...it's the group divider header.  Needless to say, inventing dividers to make the format of the data look pretty at the expense of actual roles assigned to actors is not going to get my vote.
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantBlair
Resistance is Futile!
Registered: October 30, 2008
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My opinion is based on both ways that this topic can be read. The first way being that the poll was created as a result of another topic. In that topic, no cast credits (and therefore no roles either) existed in the end credits at all. All had to be added from another source. The second way being how the initial post makes the topic sound to me. That is, saying that there actually is a cast listing found in the credits but still no cast roles.


In both cases I would vote not to add dividers due the lacking any existence of any dividers within the film credits (with the exception that in the second example (of cast in credits but without roles) are somehow grouped together in a logical way (such as a batch of 6 squared off with a gap and then another batch of three, and so on... each performing a different grouped role)

I also feel that, due to lack of a rule (that I know of, either specific or implied) about "no roles listed," if dividers were used and then someone found reason to change the role names -- more specifically to break them up from "apes" to one "orangutan," five "apes," and one "chimpanzee" -- how are they then reordered in the cast list and then regrouped with dividers?

Lack of any other reason, not using dividers is the simpler option with the fewest possible changing variables.
If at first you don't succeed, skydiving isn't for you.

He who MUST get the last word in on a pointless, endless argument doesn't win. It makes him the bigger jerk.
 Last edited: by Blair
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorsurfeur51
Since July 3, 2003
Registered: March 29, 2007
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Quoting mdnitoil:
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I fully recognize that my opinion is in the minority.


Nobody knows what is the majority. We are so few in those forums that a majority here may be the minority among all dvdprofiler users. But I agree with what you wrote. I also do not see much interest in the features of the program that try to reproduce exactly what we can  see on covers (bold and italics in overviews), or on screen (group dividers in credits). For those informations, I prefer scans or screenshots, and I hope Ken will not add a feature with headshots in plain text  . A database is interesting to use database functions, as sorting, filtering, linking... and group dividers add nothing for that. I find them totally ugly  (just a personnal taste) and I never use them in my local.

I understand those cosmetic features, but I think they should remain non contributable, as are headshots or galery images.
Images from movies
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